In five years' time you'll say: 'has the market been successful?' and you will evaluate it on how many New Zealand-owned companies have generated wealth for the country.

The savings available for companies to grow out of is just more robust than it is in New Zealand, which has not addressed the savings pool issue. That is in a nutshell, the issue that faces the listed market.

What all people who are engaged in positions of responsibility at all companies need to understand is what are the consequences of certain things. You've got to look at this as signals for the long run ...